Obsidian Portal Launch Feedback

1101113151648

Comments

  • Leonidas300
    Leonidas300
    Posts: 271
    and once again you don't get that this is not just about fixing what's been broken its for going on independently in the future!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
  • Stem
    Stem
    Posts: 4
    Like many others I have to comment I am not happy with these changes. I too am a paying customer and I do not like this new direction. I feel space is poorly utilised and I am going to have to dedicate alot of time to make my campaign compatible with this new layout. While I would do that if I felt this new layout was beneficial to my campaign I simply do not. Unless some steps back towards the old layout are taken or an option to reset to the old system is introduced I'm sorry to say you'll be losing a customer.
  • Leonidas300
    Leonidas300
    Posts: 271 edited November 2013
    well now that I am really torqued

    "If you don’t try and completely redo the sites design, OP works perfectly fine as-is"

    IF THIS IS EVEN REMOTELY TRUE WHY ARE ALL OF THESE FIXES BEING DONE??
    Post edited by Leonidas300 on
  • MadDogMaddux
    MadDogMaddux
    Posts: 10
    Leonidas300, Langy, do you guys thnk maybe you could move your discussion to another thread? It seems that it might be counterproductive to the purpose of this particular thread. Thanks!
  • Leonidas300
    Leonidas300
    Posts: 271
    MadDogMaddux

    No, I don't - this is the feedback thread and when a person who is involved in the process is trying to blatantly dismiss/downplay problems under dismissive/excusive jargon, then they need to be called out on the BS they are spewing.

    It's crap Langy, quit saying it isn't crap because it pisses people off because we all know it's BS.
  • Langy
    Langy
    Posts: 364 edited November 2013
    "THAT IS OUTRIGHT FALSE and exactly the kind of piss in my ear and tell me it’s raining crap that many, myself included are very angry about. I am going to step away from this conversation for a bit because anything I have to say right now while true, will not be cordial."

    How does it require any new knowledge? All the systems are the same. It requires some knowledge to alter the site significantly, yes - but it did so before the reforging, too!

    Now, if you simply went onto the forums and took code that you didn't understand and smashed it into your site - that could work for completely altering the site. But the person who originally wrote that code had the knowledge, and you'll be able to do the same thing now - you just need to be sure to use code that's been updated to the new design rather than old code.

    Yes, there _are_ parts of the site which are 'crap', like the image embedding function. But those 'crap' parts are being fixed, and most of the rest isn't 'crap' - it's just different, and your code simply needs to be updated to handle the difference. This doesn't require any more specialized knowledge than what was needed to write that code in the first place, though, and OP's provided options to help you get that stuff done easily.

    Going on independently in the future will work _exactly_ as it did prior to the reforging, since absolutely _nothing_ about that has changed at all. If you disagree with that, can you explain how _anything at all_ has changed in regards to moving on independently?

    Stem: It isn't going to go back to the old layout - but you don't have to fix your campaign yourself.I've been trying to explain the vanguard system and encourage people to utilize it; it essentially boils down to asking someone else to fix your site for you. Would something like that be of interest?
    Post edited by Langy on
  • Thorvaldr
    Thorvaldr
    Posts: 141
    Acceding that this is the right forum for feedback, I would request a... lowering of hostilities. I understand why people feel very strongly about the reforging, I don't think anyone is ecstatic by it, and those that have leaned towards the "defending" side I believe feel more of an acquiescence than an approbation.

    I know I'm relatively new in terms of being active on the forums, but I have been lurking here for almost a year stealing bits of code and ideas from the community. And in general this community feels helpful, welcoming and friendly.

    Many of us have put in untold hours making our campaigns our own, and to see much of that changed to a fairly severe degree, and not all of us having the tools or knowledge to easily bring it back to its former glory... it is frustrating. I am still skeptical of some of the reforge, but those things I've been most skeptical of I've heard are being looked into, and probably being fixed. So I am reserving my harsher words to give the dev team at least a month or so to sort everything out. I agree that when we supported the reforge, we were _not_ expecting to _lose_ functionality. But, I think most of it will be put back in the coming weeks/months, and right now we're in an awkward time of disfunctionality and change.

    So, I don't expect people to be happy and complacent with the Reforge. The issues need to be brought up, and they need to be fixed. But I do request that everyone engages each other in a more amicable way, because I do like these forums, and I do like this community, and I would like it to feel like a comfortable place for everyone to communicate.
  • Leonidas300
    Leonidas300
    Posts: 271
    I explained quite well above why I don't want to *HAVE TO* use the use the Vanguard system to fix my page, but because you are blind to comprehending that people want to be able to do the things on their page without asking for a bunch of help, have someone do it for them or be able to change things in the future without aid of a Vanguard you are not hearing it.

    You instead are either purposely or callously dismissing people's valid criticisms and even more valid anger, often by trying to put it back on them (I can find at least two instances where you did this and later had to back off of it, would you like me to cut and paste those posts here?). You did it again with “Leonidas and Praesi apparently don’t want to use the vanguard system”

    Here it is:

    You can find at least a half a dozen posts I’ve put up asking how to do something, another half dozen or more encouraging people not to leave and to try to work through the problems. I have outright convinced others including COTM winners not to leave. I have not hidden my anger, disappointment and frustration nor do I believe I should.
    I want the ability to bring my vision across without having others do it for me because if I don’t understand how it works or cannot do it, how can I possibly maintain or change it without being beholden to another.

    That along with the other reasons I laid out above is why I am trying to work through it and not using a vanguard.

    Are you clear on that now?


    "Leonidas300":http://www.obsidianportal.com/campaign/metzger/wikis/leonidas300
    "A Manifestation of Chaos":http://www.obsidianportal.com/campaign/metzger/wikis/main-page
    COTM - Sept. 2012
  • Langy
    Langy
    Posts: 364
    If you want to be able to completely alter your site on your own, then OK, that makes sense, Leonidas. But I've been saying it's not _required_, and it's not a change from how OP was before the reforging, either; if you wanted to know how to completely change the site design, you still needed to learn CSS/HTML back then, too.
  • Keryth987
    Keryth987
    Posts: 992 edited November 2013
    OK, need to interject here.

    Leonidas and Praesi,

    I felt the same way you do about what the Reforge did to my campaign. Shadows Over New York only won COTM back in July and I spent a LONG time working on the site. In addition, my campaign is currently running.

    However, I was able to get it back on it's feet and running. And now and slowly polishing it up and restoring it to how it was. And with NO CSS. I am using 1-2 lines of CSS to remove the whitebox, thats it. The rest is all the same way i did it before, all DIV statements.

    Not that I'm not taking advantage of the reforge to change some things up and take some advantage of the CSS. I plan on it, to have a better Shadows site than before.

    Either way though, for now, my site is as it was before, except for some Adventure Logs that need polishing up still.

    So, there's no reason to get all upset. Really. And no need to be a CSS master either.

    And if there is something you want to do CSS wise, just pipe up here and ask how. Everyone, as always, is awesomely helpful, even providing explainations as to WHY something does what it does.

    Oh, and BTW, I didn't use the Vanguard system either. Though, I wish something like that had been aorund when I started out originally. If I'd not stumbled on Wolfhound's old Tutorials, I never would have a site at all as good as i do now. Nice to know there's somewhere for people to go besides the forums, for help

    Keelah Se'lai,
    Keryth
    "Shadows Over New York":http://www.obsidianportal.com/campaigns/shadows-over-new-york
    "Campaign of the Month - July 2013":http://blog.obsidianportal.com/shadows-over-new-york-julys-campaign-of-the-month/
    Post edited by Keryth987 on

  • MarkGiguere
    MarkGiguere
    Posts: 53
    @Micah

    Thanks for the update. Sub-forums and image uploads will go a long way to address the major issues most people have had.
  • MdBLimited
    MdBLimited
    Posts: 20
    I had basically given up on our very customized site but our "webmaster" - ImmortalDM - wasn't deterred. He has worked on the site for a few hours and made major progress getting things back to how they were. I admit I was surprised. ImmortalDM doesn't have a programming background, but he said it wasn't too bad... so there is hope. Initially, I had given up on the site after the Reforge but, with only a few hours work, it is on its way. Are there many hours left to rework things to make them look good again? Yes. Am I still disappointed we have to spend more time fixing something that was working for us? Yes. Is it all a total loss? No. Am I still working on having a campaign binder as a non-digital primary resource? Yes. What would make all the pain worth it to me: natural editing.

    Myyth Realm: Legacy
    Campaign of the Month (April 2013)
  • deljohn
    deljohn
    Posts: 24
    Maybe I am doing this wrong but WIKI LINK button does not appear to function for me.

    In the old site I would highlight text on a page I was editing then click the wiki link button to bring up the list of wiki pages and select the appropriate page. Am I doing something wrong or did I just miss the report that this feature is broken?

    Thanks!

    JohnD
  • Meagoinc
    Meagoinc
    Posts: 26
    1) I mentioned it earlier, but I'd just love to reiterate how nice it would be to be able to access the forums and other campaigns from any page on OP rather than having to go to the dashboard and then scroll to the bottom and click on "Community". There's all this lovely space on the top bar-- could you put it back there, as it was before, please? The community is a major reason to hang around, and at this period of time the forums are particularly crucial. It feels a bit counterintuitive that the best way to learn how to fix our OP sites is through the forums, but we can't reach the forums through any of our "in character" OP pages!!

    2) Please bring back the sitewide search in the right hand corner! It is bizarre to have to go OUT of OP to search for campaigns in OP!

    3) I notice that although there is now a darker grey in the CSS and editing area, it's still white-on-grey and a lot of the buttons and the dashboard are varying shades of grey-on-grey. If we could make that a more readable black-on-white, or even black-on-grey, if we must, that would be immensely useful in helping folk like me (and I'm not that old! I'm only 26!) read large blocks of text and edit CSS (which I'm just learning, and it's easy to lose my place, particularly when I can hardly read it).

    It's nice that some folk have their campaigns all up and to par again, but different campaigns require different material to get back to their original "look". Even though I have Thorvaldr working on the CSS (and it's technically his campaign... >.> ), Tyellador is nowhere near where it was before to me, visually. Yes, the wiki pages are essentially the same, especially now that Thorvaldr's fixed the background and all, but the SETTING of those pages is altered in a manner which forces me to rethink my previous layout and how to effectively express our campaign through images. The changing of the buttons and the layout means that we have to creatively reimagine how to engagingly present our homebrewed medieval world in this ultra-modern Windows 8-like scheme. What we've cobbled together is still massively displeasing visually, particularly with the adventure logs, and even _I_ am having trouble navigating through the wiki which _I mainly wrote_.

    Yes, fixing it is technically possible to do, yes, half of the reason things don't look pretty is because I haven't bothered to make new buttons and banners for stuff, yes, we knew it was coming...but that doesn't make it easier even when you have a CSS expert in your corner. :-/ I still have to do all these things, I still am sort of horrified at the idea that people might be looking at the site before we fix it up again (no links in this post!!!). As a perfectionist who takes hours on finding images and editing them to a purpose... it's not just an issue of "3 hours with CSS and it's back to normal!" There's more to edit because more things are sans-serif flat-buttoned modern-looking, and there're different dimensions and different positions for the things which existed before. I do know that being able to preview the Reforged site beforehand was a donation incentive, but I wish we'd been able to see an interactive mockup before the shift in order to ponder the changes we'd have to make thereafter.

    Mox nix! Please reconnect the OP sites to the larger OP community via the dashboard again, that is the most important thing! Thank you for listening!
  • Desert_Son
    Desert_Son
    Posts: 16
    Hello,

    Been reading through this thread and trying to understand implications for my role in our campaign site. At present, unless my understanding is incorrect, it looks like I will need more CSS knowledge in order to make substantive visual changes to our site, such as adjusting text composition windows to be black text on white background (my eyesight has trouble discerning white text on gray background), as well as making other changes to image size, etc.

    Before I can make any of those changes, however, it appears that I need access to a "Settings" button on the left-hand Dashboard toolbar, bottom.

    It looks like this is my first stumbling block. I am a player, not the GM, of the campaign, nor am I an Ascendant member. No "Settings" button appears for me when I log in and access our campaign site. I can still select an Adventure Log composition window to create a new adventure log entry (that's what I do in our campaign; I'm the scribe), but as for other changes to the site, such as banners, images, text/background color contrast manipulation, etc., do I need to be the GM and/or Ascendant in order to implement any of the changes?

    Thank you for any time and attention anyone might be able to provide.

    Still learning,

    Robert
    Adventure Log writer for "Geeks Distributed":https://geeks-distributed.obsidianportal.com/
  • Langy
    Langy
    Posts: 364
    Yes, you need to be the GM to alter banners/background images, and you need to be both the GM and ascendant in order to edit text/background color contrast manipulation for the whole site (though as a player you can edit the text/background of specific portions of the site).

    This is no different from how it was before the reforge, however - the difference is what the default is.
  • SkidAce
    SkidAce
    Posts: 830
    For those with long forums, and the "top" and "bottom" buttons don't seem to work properly (mainly the bottom);

    click on the side where the posts are and hit the "end" button. Boom! End of forum thread.
  • Desert_Son
    Desert_Son
    Posts: 16
    Langy,

    Thank you for the clarification.

    Still learning,

    Robert
    Adventure Log writer for "Geeks Distributed":https://geeks-distributed.obsidianportal.com/
  • twiggyleaf
    twiggyleaf
    Posts: 1,902
    Aaaah, banner change again....just when I was beginning to get used to my new temporary banner. I say temporary, but then I got to like it, and decided to scale it properly and keep it. Ah well, I suppose I can do that again after Thursday. With all the "arguments" above, I just wanted to say that, although utterly paralysed and bewildered at the original REFORGE, I could see where it was going and was in favour of most of the changes. I have opted for the VANGUARD thing, and thanks to Wolfhound, my site is now looking better than ever before (with just a few PICTURE issues that I'm sure will be sorted out soon).

    Our group used the SUBFORUMS quite substantially so I am looking forward to them returning and hope it does not require too much "REFORGING", but overall, with the new look, and the help of the VANGUARD system, I am happy with the way things have gone. It has meant that I have had to put in more work to the look of the site instead of the prep of the campaign (now brought forward to start next week instead of next year), but at least my players will have a good-looking (I hope I am not being too subjective here) reference to use.

    twigs

    "I met a traveller from an antique land....."

    CotM May 2016: Mysteria: set in Wolfgang Baur’s MIDGARD.

    Previous CotM Aug 2012: Shimring: High Level Multiplanar Campaign

    Inner Council Member

  • GamingMegaverse
    GamingMegaverse
    Posts: 2,962
    Happy that the subforums are coming back for the PbP people out there (fyi, on Rebuilt, there is one forum post- stating we don't use it) and the image fix will be huge for all of us!
    The banner change is a bit of a pain, but overall a huge improvement, so I applaud it.
    I encourage the development team to take a good look at Belrathius' comprehensive "list":http://forums.obsidianportal.com/comments.php?DiscussionID=3414 which he has taken a lot of time to compile.
    I want to share a comment I got in a PM, that has been echoed elsewhere, but this is from a new Portalier, and I think it is well said. It is in response to me saying that the Comments section for each campaign is coming back, which was intimated early in the Reforge, but has not been mentioned in a while-
    "Man, I am so freaking glad that they're bringing that back. I was going around trying to make friends and had no idea how to do it on here"
    Please bring the Comments back, along with the search all option (to find campaigns, issues, and users) and the popular campaign listings!
    killervp
    "A God...Rebuilt":https://a-god-rebuilt.obsidianportal.com
    "OP's COTM April 2012":http://blog.obsidianportal.com/a-god-rebuilt-aprils-cotm/
    Unabashadly pushing for 300 fans!

    Just trying to help out.

  • Cernig
    Cernig
    Posts: 60
    "Please bring the Comments back, along with the search all option (to find campaigns, issues, and users) and the popular campaign listings!"

    Yep. Otherwise you'll just have a collection of campaign wikis, rather than a gaming community. Using these options is how Langy and I got to know folks on and around OP.
  • Keryth987
    Keryth987
    Posts: 992
    Yes. Bring back the Comments Page. It was wonderful reading what people not only thought of my own campaign, but of the many campaigns i follow.

    Also, looking forward eagerly to having the embed image issue resolved. Right now, I have a test site where I'm dumping images and linking to them there from Shadows

    Keelah Se'lai,
    Keryth
    "Shadows Over New York":http://www.obsidianportal.com/campaigns/shadows-over-new-york
    "Campaign of the Month - July 2013":http://blog.obsidianportal.com/shadows-over-new-york-julys-campaign-of-the-month/

  • deljohn
    deljohn
    Posts: 24
    Sorry to ask this again but I am wondering if the CHARACTER LINK and WIKI LINK buttons are working for users when editing wiki pages. Nothing seems to happen when I click these buttons so I am wondering if it's a bug or it just works different now...

    Thanks!
  • bassoon201
    bassoon201
    Posts: 9
    Am I missing something? In the old site for character creation, one had a bunch of templates to choose from (Pathfinder template being the one I used)

    In the new site there are no templates to choose from. Is this intentional? Because I really would like to have that option back for my characters in my campaign...
  • Sorceress
    Sorceress
    Posts: 25 edited November 2013
    @deljohn - The CHARACTER LINK and WIKI LINK work for me just fine. It should bring up a pop up with a list on it for you. I assume they aren't doing that. Could be they're just lagging all to heck. Other than that, I dunno.

    @bassoon201 - They do still have the dynamic character sheets on character creation(if that's what you're talking about). Up top you've got the box for Name, Slug, Tags, and Quick Description. Right below that box are the Dynamic character sheets, it's possible
    its color is white on white (which seems to be an issue with some the reforge stuff) but they should be a drop down menu right there - runs the length of screen for me with the arrow for opening it on the far right. Hope that helps.

    Sorceress
    "The Hero Academy":https://the-hero-academy.obsidianportal.com/
    Post edited by Sorceress on
  • Nestor
    Nestor
    Posts: 10 edited November 2013
    I'll jump in to make one comment to Langy in response to something he posted.

    For me, it's not an issue of having to re-work changes to my page. It's the fact that I had no code in the first place; I was perfectly happy with the way the page looked out-of-the-box and was fine just adding content. I'll repeat this because it's important, I did not make any customizations to my page, so there was no code that I felt needed to be fixed because of the upcoming reforge.

    Now, the site is, to be blunt, ugly and non-intuitive, from the color schemes to the way characters are organized and displayed to... well, this thread has listed pretty much all the issues. And the only solution I'm given to resolve this is to roll up my sleeves and dig into CSS code, or engage with some stranger to try and get this done.

    So I went from something simple and easy for me to use to something that needs fixing from the get-go just to get to an acceptable point of use.

    Again, it's not that I'm refusing to use the resources you're offering to get my campaign page working, it's that it's become necessary to use those resources when I didn't have to before. That's the source of my (and I'm sure other's) frustration.

    It's like someone selling me a new car then telling me I need to install the tires and the brakes before I can drive it away, or get someone to come over and do it for me.

    I said this before and I'll say it again here, if I was a prospective GM looking for a place to host my campaign and came upon OP as it looks now, I would not choose it, nor would I recommend it to anybody else. And that saddens me, because I would not have said that a year ago.
    Post edited by Nestor on
  • bassoon201
    bassoon201
    Posts: 9
    @Sorceress

    I Don't seem to have that option, and I am a paying customer. There is nothing below the quick description, just description. I highlighted everything to see if I missed it but no drop down box is there. I'm running Firefox on an old windows XP if that might matter...
  • Sorceress
    Sorceress
    Posts: 25
    Ok Bassoon201,

    Perhaps I've tracked down your problem (it could be as simple as forgetting to do something). Go to your campaign settings - basic settings and see if you've actually picked your game system and saved it. Cause I noticed on one of my
    newer campaigns I couldn't get dynamic sheets like you are saying and then realized I hadn't filled in that field.

    Try that,
    Sorceress,
    GM of
    "The Hero Academy":https://the-hero-academy.obsidianportal.com/
  • Stem
    Stem
    Posts: 4
    I agree with Nestors point and the idea he is trying to get across perfectly. I have used OP for over three years for different campaigns, I used it straight out of the box and was happy with that. Now I'm having to learn CSS or get someone else to mod my campaign just to make it passable. That just doesn't make sense. OP was fine how it was for most of us, now they've changed it so that almost everyone is having to heavily mod it to get it 'usable'. That just isn't logical and it certainly isn't 'out of the box' friendly anymore.
  • Langy
    Langy
    Posts: 364
    Nestor: What are the actual things you want to change to make your campaign 'usable', in your words? Is it an issue with color contrast, campaign width, banner resizing? All of those issues are being addressed or have been already (though I'll admit to not being a fan of the default color scheme).

    What aspect of the site is a problem for people who _haven't_ customized their campaigns? Other than colors, I can't think of any that isn't already being addressed or has been already - you'll be getting quite a bit more functionality and customizability out of OP once everything's done, actually.
This discussion has been closed.

July 2022
Signs and Portends

Read the feature post on the blog
Return to Obsidian Portal

Howdy, Stranger!

It looks like you're new here. If you want to get involved, click one of these buttons!

Discussions